Looking for some expert advice, Serial # 0F368185 is for a 5.7L Alpha - Maxum Boat Owners Club

oneradride · 05-22-2011, 02:47 AM

Looking for some expert advice.... I really messed up and missed a drain plug last fall and now the block is cracked internally and leaking water into the oil. It's a 1995 Maxum with a 5.7 merc.

Serial # 0F368185 is for a 5.7L Alpha engine that was built at MerCruiser on 7-7-94. This engine has 2 bolt main bearing caps, a cast iron camshaft and steel fuel pump and push rods. It was built with flat lifters.

My question is, can I run a newer (than 1995) marine engine and have everything bolt back up? Everything I'm reading about engines says 87-95 and then 96 and newer? What's the difference? I think the 1995 and newer are vortec so a short block probably would not accept my current intake, maybe not even the exhaust.... Please let me know your thoughts, pro/cons anything.

oneradride · 05-22-2011, 02:51 AM

Considering something like this.. just not sure the alpha drive will handle 420 HP?
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...K%3AMEWAX%3AIT

tjwieseler · 05-22-2011, 04:42 AM

I changed my engine last summer. I have a 1997 2400scr with the 5.7 EFI non vortec. When I bought mine I was told that any 5.7 would work, but if you went to a vortec you would have to change the intake. Without changing the TBI and engine module the engine wouldn't have any more horsepower. The Alpha drive will only take 300 hp. I considered the 382 stroked but didn't want to spend the $
So I just replaced it with a non vortec 2 bolt main and roller lifters just like the OEM.

Purchased mine from S & J Engines out of Spokane WA, so far so good.

seapuppy · 05-22-2011, 01:55 PM

oh man...sorry to hear about the engine cracks.....that's why we stress here to follow procedures and to winterize properly...with that said...

michigan motors makes a bunch of engines right for your spec....they specialize in merc's with a1g2 engine/drive combo...

so...here's the deal....replace it with an 5.7mpi/6.2ltr mpi engines...either one will bolt right up.....
take pic's ...we wanna see

SP

oneradride · 05-22-2011, 06:31 PM

Multiple port injection? I'll need a computer, electronic fuel pump and god only knows what else to do that wont I?

oldno7 · 05-22-2011, 10:12 PM

I don't know anything about these folks, but heres another option.

http://www.usmarineengine.com/mercru...ne-engine.html

seapuppy · 05-22-2011, 10:53 PM

Michigan motors can be purchased complete....ready to drop in and go..

SP

ShoreAcres · 05-23-2011, 07:30 AM

I missed the plug on the bottom of the hose on my 5.7 last winter, but drained the other 4. It was just pure dumb luck there was no damage. I assume you missed one of the four block plugs? Sorry about yours.

shrew · 05-23-2011, 12:41 PM

Is it just the block or do you need new heads. If I recall a short block is without the heads and a long block includes new heads. Both should allow you to re-use a majority of the parts (provided they're undamaged) from the old motor. A lot will depend on how mechanically inclined you are. If I recall, you did some extensive work with a Corsa switchable through hull exhaust. This 'might' be within your technical aptitude. I did a full replacement and went from carb to MPI and WOW what a difference. Of course a full package swap is significantly easier.

oneradride · 05-23-2011, 02:25 PM

Thanks for the replies everyone. It really does suck and I'm beating myself up a little. I know better and have winterized it correctly in the past. 3 kids going nuts can make you lose track of thing pretty easy.

That said, I have built several motors and I'm no stranger to a 350. I also have a 1970 Chevelle (fifth one) and almost thought about pulling the engine in that to put in the boat. However the cam is much too large and I'm sure it would suck water into the exhaust. Finding an engine around Omaha is not an issue. My primary question is will a 1996 and new motor bolt up the existing components. I'll my internals are still good, it still runs. (however I'm not going to start it again in this condition) I missed the plug between 3 and 5 above the oil pan in the center BTW....

Heads are also fine, just wondering if I should find a 95 block and swap the internals or buy a short block and make quick work of it.... cost to power is also a concern I don't mind spending more to get more. I love a loopy idle and I want more power. 300+

Shrew you are correct, the exhaust job was me

Surprised no one else has tried it yet!!

seapuppy · 05-23-2011, 02:48 PM

well..a chevy is a chevy...that's the nice thing about those engines...the only difference between a street engine and a marine are the components that are attached....flame arresting items and items subject to corrosion....

you had me scared there for a minute when you mentioned dropping in the engine from the chevelle...yes...it might suck in water..but the main problem is the components that would rust off or spark.....

if it were me...(and since your a gear head also)..I'd get a new shortblock....drop the items from the old engine onto the new one...drop that onto the boat and away you go...the only real hard part is the alignment of the engine to the drive and boat...you may need help with that one but that might be the only issue....

now..if you decide to go over 300hp...you need to change the drive out from an a1g2 drive to a b2/b3 drive...the alpha 1 drive is only good too 300 hp....

good luck and take lotsa pic's of the project....

SP

ss3964spd · 05-23-2011, 03:45 PM

Total, total bummer about the cracked block.

Clearly, the fastest way back to the water is a long block and, if I were doing it, the LB would have a roller in it. With most of todays oils being un-friendly to flat tappet cams it would be a heart breaker to go thru all the difficulty of doing an engine swap in a boat and then lose the cam during break-in or just after. Next would be a short block and fit it yourself with roller cam, lifters, push rods (shorter because of the taller roller lifters), and new valve springs (to deal with the extra weight of the heavier roller lifters) then swap everything else over.

You could, of course, go with a used bare block but there is go guaranty that your internals will work in it - especially the pistons, since it's likely a used block will need to be, or already has been, bored oversize. You also won't know if the mains have been align honed - although that's not as common as it being bored. So at the very least you'd likely have to plan in new pistons/rings anyway, and have them pressed onto your rods.

I guess it comes down to how much time you have to build an engine. The 350 out of your Chevelle? Still going to need to re-cam it, if it has steel freeze plugs those'll need to be replaced with brass, you'll have to make sure the compression isn't too high for the gas you use in the boat. But it will physically bolt right up (as will a "vortec" based small block since those were really different only in regards to the heads).

Dan

oneradride · 05-23-2011, 11:40 PM

Any thoughts on the expired eBay link I posted earlier? Too much power? I think if I ease into it, it might be okay..... plus I'll be running the factory Merc intake and 4 brl carb that might knock it down some.... probably over rated HP anyway. Any recommendations on bang for the buck? Anyone know the largest cam you can run in a marine 5.7?

oneradride · 05-24-2011, 03:43 AM

This might be a better option than the 383 420 HP...

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/96-02...item27bb1e3b8b

Price sound about right? Rated at 300 HP so no issues with the outdrive, I think I'm more conferrable with that. Also says 96-02 with the roller cam that SS3964spd mentioned. Should have no problems with intake and exhaust right?

ss3964spd · 05-24-2011, 01:52 PM

ORR,

It isn't HP that will tear up the outdrive, it's torque that kills them - in the same manner that bags of torque will destroy the rear end in your Chevelle. The 383 at 420 HP will also be making a LOT more torque than your old 350. Although you could ease into it, once you are running at 3500-4000 - where I bet that 383 will be making it's peak torque, all that torque will be going to the drive at that RPM. I don't think the A1 will be happy. Yeah, you could de-tune it with a smaller carb and less timing but why bother and spend the extra money?

Given your drive the 350/5.7 at 300 is a better, safer, option. I looked at that ad and they noted "center mount valve covers" which means, I'm pretty certain, vortec heads. The old style heads have, I believe, 8 bolt holes per side for the intake whereas vortec heads have 4 per side. You should verify. Regardless, a vortec intake for a 4 bbl carb isn't terribly expensive, and I don't think the distributor cares - but verify that too. I don't like hyper pistions (forged are far better) - they are brittle, but everyone uses them so they are probably fine. They don't like detonation, at all, so make sure your ignition timing is right.

Although nice, I wouldn't put much stock in the warranty on any mail order engine. If anything goes wrong it is still going to be you yanking it and shipping it back. If you can find anything local - even if a little more expensive, consider that route. But regardless of where you source the engine be certain you check all feedback. Lots of engines being built in sheads.

Dan

tjwieseler · 05-24-2011, 02:22 PM

My 1997 5.7 EFI engine has the center bolt valve covers and the composite timing chain cover, but is still not a vortec. The only thing that you can tell that denotes the Vortec is the intake manifold. The non Vortec has 12 bolts and the Vortec intake has 8 bolts. $2400 seems like an awful lot for that long block, and without the proper fuel delivery system (carb/EFI and Intake) I doubt you will ever see 300HP.

oneradride · 05-25-2011, 07:35 PM

I can get 5.7 VORTEC engines all day long around here for around 1000. but they are automotive. Change the cam and the freeze plugs and I'm good to go? Suppose I'd also have to find a place to mount and wire the computer, bypass any factory antitheft crap and add an electronic fuel pump.... damn that sounds like a lot of work.... would be nice not to jack with a carburetor though.

ss3964spd · 05-25-2011, 08:40 PM

I think it would be easier (by far), faster, and less expensive to remove all the automotive FI stuff and replace the factory intake with an after market 4 BBL intake designed for the Vortec heads. You would still have to fit a marine grade low pressure fuel pump (and possibly a regulator and return line) if the Vortec engine does not have a mechanical puel pump mounting pad.

In addition to swapping the cam and all the freeze plugs, trying to get the auto computer to work right, not to mention its wiring harness, could be a handfull. If the Vortec distributor is controlled by the ECM you'd have to sort that out too. The high pressure fuel pump needed to feed the injection system could be a problem also. If you remote mount the pump (the automotive pumps are inside the fuel tanks) you'd have to have supply lines made due to the high pressure the pumps operate at. Regular rubber gas line for a carb application isn't going to cut it. From what I understand most, if not all, marine engines use a high pressure oil pump as well. Finally, if you were to get it running you still have a used engine with an unknown life expectancy.

I would source a direct replacement 5.7 for your application. You might spend more up front but will avoid a lot of hassles, not to mention getting back on the water sooner. That, or spend the big bucks for a complete - including computer, 5.7 MPI engine.

Dan

oneradride · 05-26-2011, 02:31 AM

You are right Dan, Thanks.... I'm just thinking if I'm going to spend the money and do all that work... it would be nice to put some at least a little better in there. You're a car guy, I know you know what I'm talking about..

oneradride · 05-26-2011, 02:37 AM

And I know all about the in the tank fuel pumps... 01 Yukon..5.3 300.00 bucks and about 6 hours. of course it had to die with a full freaking tank. This has been kind of a shitty year. On the plus side I just got the new quarters welded on the Chevelle.

and I forgot to mention the intake manifold gasket leak on the yukon also..... another 110.00 for the teal intake gaskets and another 4 hours.... FML